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	<title>Comments on: Less Guns equals less gun related deaths, statistics don&#8217;t lie</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/</link>
	<description>blogging is not a spectator sport</description>
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		<title>By: NunyerB</title>
		<link>http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/comment-page-1/#comment-338502</link>
		<dc:creator>NunyerB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Aug 2009 14:12:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/#comment-338502</guid>
		<description>Gunner, when your government comes to take your gun away, you will politely give it to them. If you don&#039;t, you will end up like David Koresh, and they will end up prying it out of your warm, crispy hand.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gunner, when your government comes to take your gun away, you will politely give it to them. If you don&#39;t, you will end up like David Koresh, and they will end up prying it out of your warm, crispy hand.</p>
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		<title>By: NunyerB</title>
		<link>http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/comment-page-1/#comment-338048</link>
		<dc:creator>NunyerB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Aug 2009 09:12:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/#comment-338048</guid>
		<description>Gunner, when your government comes to take your gun away, you will politely give it to them. If you don&#039;t, you will end up like David Koresh, and they will end up prying it out of your warm, crispy hand.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gunner, when your government comes to take your gun away, you will politely give it to them. If you don&#39;t, you will end up like David Koresh, and they will end up prying it out of your warm, crispy hand.</p>
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		<title>By: NunyerB</title>
		<link>http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/comment-page-1/#comment-336656</link>
		<dc:creator>NunyerB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Aug 2009 07:12:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/#comment-336656</guid>
		<description>Gunner, when your government comes to take your gun away, you will politely give it to them. If you don&#039;t, you will end up like David Koresh, and they will end up prying it out of your warm, crispy hand.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gunner, when your government comes to take your gun away, you will politely give it to them. If you don&#39;t, you will end up like David Koresh, and they will end up prying it out of your warm, crispy hand.</p>
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		<title>By: Gunner</title>
		<link>http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/comment-page-1/#comment-323721</link>
		<dc:creator>Gunner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Apr 2009 07:12:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/#comment-323721</guid>
		<description>Mister you are an idiot. The second ammendment gives me every right to bear arms. To try and take that right away from me will only get yourself hurt.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mister you are an idiot. The second ammendment gives me every right to bear arms. To try and take that right away from me will only get yourself hurt.</p>
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		<title>By: Eric Carter</title>
		<link>http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/comment-page-1/#comment-322184</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Carter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 04 Apr 2009 19:49:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/#comment-322184</guid>
		<description>Your absolutely correct, so lets get right to the Stats. The most recent complete list.&lt;br&gt; 2005 Alcohol related deaths. CAR - 43,443 dead; of those 306 were children. Alcohol claimed over 100,000 total lives in 2005.&lt;br&gt; 2005 Cardiovascular Disease Deaths 864,480 dead. 35.3% of ALL deaths or 1 out of every 2.8.&lt;br&gt; 2005 Cancer deaths 559,312&lt;br&gt; 2005 gun deaths. 12,352 homicides              40%&lt;br&gt;                                  17,002 suicides                  55%&lt;br&gt;                                        330 legal intervention&lt;br&gt;                                        221 undetermined          5%&lt;br&gt; During the 10 year span from 1994 to 2003 there were 616 law enforcment officers killed in the line of duty.&lt;br&gt; Now do your own research. There were more street &amp; highway workers killed on the job than policemen and firefighters COMBINED.  Do you REALLY think we would better off living in a country were ONLY our government had guns? Now theres a scarry thought. When you really get down to the STATS, don&#039;t  you agree our time, money, and our effort would be better spent on the things that will do our country some good. &lt;br&gt; We are still fighting the war on drugs and losing. You want to reduce gun crimes? Reduce the number of criminals and stop the drug traffic trade. &lt;br&gt; New or more stringent gun laws make LESS sense than proabition.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your absolutely correct, so lets get right to the Stats. The most recent complete list.<br /> 2005 Alcohol related deaths. CAR &#8211; 43,443 dead; of those 306 were children. Alcohol claimed over 100,000 total lives in 2005.<br /> 2005 Cardiovascular Disease Deaths 864,480 dead. 35.3% of ALL deaths or 1 out of every 2.8.<br /> 2005 Cancer deaths 559,312<br /> 2005 gun deaths. 12,352 homicides              40%<br />                                  17,002 suicides                  55%<br />                                        330 legal intervention<br />                                        221 undetermined          5%<br /> During the 10 year span from 1994 to 2003 there were 616 law enforcment officers killed in the line of duty.<br /> Now do your own research. There were more street &#038; highway workers killed on the job than policemen and firefighters COMBINED.  Do you REALLY think we would better off living in a country were ONLY our government had guns? Now theres a scarry thought. When you really get down to the STATS, don&#39;t  you agree our time, money, and our effort would be better spent on the things that will do our country some good. <br /> We are still fighting the war on drugs and losing. You want to reduce gun crimes? Reduce the number of criminals and stop the drug traffic trade. <br /> New or more stringent gun laws make LESS sense than proabition.</p>
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		<title>By: Gun and gun control - Page 3 - Volconvo Debate Forums</title>
		<link>http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/comment-page-1/#comment-203301</link>
		<dc:creator>Gun and gun control - Page 3 - Volconvo Debate Forums</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Dec 2007 18:06:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/#comment-203301</guid>
		<description>[...] by: HelioPrime   To make it official then:  Less Guns Equals Less Gun Related Deaths    And European data says differently. Clearly the correlation isn&#039;t a causual relationship.   [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] by: HelioPrime   To make it official then:  Less Guns Equals Less Gun Related Deaths    And European data says differently. Clearly the correlation isn&#8217;t a causual relationship.   [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Gun and gun control - Page 2 - Volconvo Debate Forums</title>
		<link>http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/comment-page-1/#comment-203154</link>
		<dc:creator>Gun and gun control - Page 2 - Volconvo Debate Forums</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Dec 2007 03:38:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/#comment-203154</guid>
		<description>[...] make it official then:  Less Guns Equals Less Gun Related Deaths   [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] make it official then:  Less Guns Equals Less Gun Related Deaths   [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Cause and Effect relationship</title>
		<link>http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/comment-page-1/#comment-108832</link>
		<dc:creator>Cause and Effect relationship</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Feb 2007 16:19:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/#comment-108832</guid>
		<description>The graph is what I like to refer to as &quot;non consequential&quot; To infer that based on lines sloping downward and to add secondary lines, that follow merely shows a trend, not a cause and effect relationship, in the pure sense that you would like. Your graph is not a &quot;Case Closed&quot; argument without digging deeper into the matrix of of the actual numbers. 

Gun related death stats often cite suicide, death by cop, and accidental shootings. These three are dubiously cited in most gun stats, but only blur the real cause and effect of any simple graph for the use of any argument for and against the ownership of guns. A previous comment explains this. Gun related deaths were on the decline, but not any more than pre ban or post ban, merely on the decline, hence their is no way to support that any measure of gun control has had a positive relationship on the decline without having a dramatic decline in gun related deaths as opposed to just a declining death rate by gun. Your graph simply indicates two things. 1. gun related deaths before the ban were already on the decline, and 2. that those deaths after still maintained a solid rate, although declining. Not enough to make a case for the proposal of banning the ownership of all guns. If there were a dramatic space between two lines after the gun ban, then possibly the cause and effect relationship could be explained. There is not !!

Here in the United States, there is without a doubt NO cause and effect relationship between those city&#039;s, states and county&#039;s that have stricter gun laws, or total gun bans. In fact, Washington D.C. is the toughest gun control district in the United States, yet has more crime and gun related deaths than any other city in the entire United States. Where is the cause and effect relationship in Washington D.C. ?? The answer is simple, there is none !! Crime is deeper than guns. Unemployment, race relations, drug trafficing, poor parental skills, and the &quot;NO HOPE&quot; attitude of it&#039;s citizens. Hence the reasons that gun related deaths often or almost alway&#039;s have a cause and effect relationship with drugs, high school drop out rate, race relations, and a whole host of other social ills that plague the city. 

I live in Kentucky. Arguably one of the highest rates of gun ownership in the country and we&#039;ve had ONE murder in the last 3 years in my county alone. That murder was a marital dispute due to infidelity. There have been NO gun related deaths as of January 1, 2007 

The estimate here is that each house hold has 2.3 guns with a rise in gun purchases in the county of 23.4% each year since 2003. We have almost no gun related deaths, and suicides that have been reported this year are of drug overdose, or hanging. How is it that we can own more guns than the entire country of Australia in one county in Kentucky and have that few gun related deaths ? it&#039;s easy. Socially, everyone, or almost every one is employed, have at least a high school education, we are predominatley white,  are county churches are filled each sunday morning, be it Catholic, Protestant, or Baptish, and our schools have a no tolerance policy for drug abuse and crime. Socially, we are what I like to refer to as &quot;God Fearing&quot; fearing people, educated, financially stable, and almost all white.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The graph is what I like to refer to as &#8220;non consequential&#8221; To infer that based on lines sloping downward and to add secondary lines, that follow merely shows a trend, not a cause and effect relationship, in the pure sense that you would like. Your graph is not a &#8220;Case Closed&#8221; argument without digging deeper into the matrix of of the actual numbers. </p>
<p>Gun related death stats often cite suicide, death by cop, and accidental shootings. These three are dubiously cited in most gun stats, but only blur the real cause and effect of any simple graph for the use of any argument for and against the ownership of guns. A previous comment explains this. Gun related deaths were on the decline, but not any more than pre ban or post ban, merely on the decline, hence their is no way to support that any measure of gun control has had a positive relationship on the decline without having a dramatic decline in gun related deaths as opposed to just a declining death rate by gun. Your graph simply indicates two things. 1. gun related deaths before the ban were already on the decline, and 2. that those deaths after still maintained a solid rate, although declining. Not enough to make a case for the proposal of banning the ownership of all guns. If there were a dramatic space between two lines after the gun ban, then possibly the cause and effect relationship could be explained. There is not !!</p>
<p>Here in the United States, there is without a doubt NO cause and effect relationship between those city&#8217;s, states and county&#8217;s that have stricter gun laws, or total gun bans. In fact, Washington D.C. is the toughest gun control district in the United States, yet has more crime and gun related deaths than any other city in the entire United States. Where is the cause and effect relationship in Washington D.C. ?? The answer is simple, there is none !! Crime is deeper than guns. Unemployment, race relations, drug trafficing, poor parental skills, and the &#8220;NO HOPE&#8221; attitude of it&#8217;s citizens. Hence the reasons that gun related deaths often or almost alway&#8217;s have a cause and effect relationship with drugs, high school drop out rate, race relations, and a whole host of other social ills that plague the city. </p>
<p>I live in Kentucky. Arguably one of the highest rates of gun ownership in the country and we&#8217;ve had ONE murder in the last 3 years in my county alone. That murder was a marital dispute due to infidelity. There have been NO gun related deaths as of January 1, 2007 </p>
<p>The estimate here is that each house hold has 2.3 guns with a rise in gun purchases in the county of 23.4% each year since 2003. We have almost no gun related deaths, and suicides that have been reported this year are of drug overdose, or hanging. How is it that we can own more guns than the entire country of Australia in one county in Kentucky and have that few gun related deaths ? it&#8217;s easy. Socially, everyone, or almost every one is employed, have at least a high school education, we are predominatley white,  are county churches are filled each sunday morning, be it Catholic, Protestant, or Baptish, and our schools have a no tolerance policy for drug abuse and crime. Socially, we are what I like to refer to as &#8220;God Fearing&#8221; fearing people, educated, financially stable, and almost all white.</p>
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		<title>By: Livinia</title>
		<link>http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/comment-page-1/#comment-96890</link>
		<dc:creator>Livinia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 07:50:36 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>statistics may not lie...but that says nothing about the people reporting those statistics!!

http://www.ic-wish.org/Baker%20and%20McPhedran%20Review%20and%20Critique%20of%20Chapman%20et%20al.pdf</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>statistics may not lie&#8230;but that says nothing about the people reporting those statistics!!</p>
<p><a href="http://www.ic-wish.org/Baker%20and%20McPhedran%20Review%20and%20Critique%20of%20Chapman%20et%20al.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.ic-wish.org/Baker%20and%20McPhedran%20Review%20and%20Critique%20of%20Chapman%20et%20al.pdf</a></p>
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		<title>By: Kim</title>
		<link>http://www.duncanriley.com/2006/12/14/less-guns-equals-less-gun-related-deaths-statistics-dont-lie/comment-page-1/#comment-71559</link>
		<dc:creator>Kim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Dec 2006 12:38:27 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Statistics don&#039;t lie?! Very amusing.

That graph that you showed indicates almost no difference pre, and post-buyback. In both cases, the trend was downwards, with what seems to be the same slope. The drop at buyback seems to be the same size as a drop that occurred in the late 80&#039;s.

I would think that statistically, you can&#039;t infer anything from that graph, except that before buyback, the gun death rate was trending down, and after buyback, it was trending down at about the same rate.

Based on the slope of the pre-buyback trend, adding an extra 4 years would result in the same gun death rate as the buyback.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Statistics don&#8217;t lie?! Very amusing.</p>
<p>That graph that you showed indicates almost no difference pre, and post-buyback. In both cases, the trend was downwards, with what seems to be the same slope. The drop at buyback seems to be the same size as a drop that occurred in the late 80&#8217;s.</p>
<p>I would think that statistically, you can&#8217;t infer anything from that graph, except that before buyback, the gun death rate was trending down, and after buyback, it was trending down at about the same rate.</p>
<p>Based on the slope of the pre-buyback trend, adding an extra 4 years would result in the same gun death rate as the buyback.</p>
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